Bevi Chagnon - PubCom.com
Community Expert
Bevi Chagnon
Leading author & trainer for accessible documents: InDesign, Word, PowerPoint, and Acrobat. Member of the ISO standards committees for PDF and PDF/UA (accessibility).
PubCom.com
Bevi Chagnon - PubCom.com
Community Expert
Bevi Chagnon
Leading author & trainer for accessible documents: InDesign, Word, PowerPoint, and Acrobat. Member of the ISO standards committees for PDF and PDF/UA (accessibility).
PubCom.com
Activity
Community Expert
in Adobe Acrobat Online Discussions
‎Dec 01, 2024
08:29 AM
‎Dec 01, 2024
08:29 AM
Hi @Tero32674472ru0t,
There are a few reasons why this can happen:
1 — Is the Archivo font a "cloud" font or is it installed in your computer's fonts folder (a traditional font)? Cloud fonts are dynamically installed and managed by an outside company (such as Adobe, Microsoft, Linotype/Monotype fonts) and often don't work well when trying to embed them into a PDF.
Solution:
Uninstall or deactive the cloud fonts from your computer system.
Reboot your computer to ensure your OS has "forgotten" about the cloud versions.
Download the real font files from Google Fonts (https://fonts.google.com/specimen/Archivo) and install them using the traditional method for your operating system. On Macs, use FontBook to install them. On Windows, drag the individual fonts into C:/Windows/Fonts folder.
Be sure to restart your computer after installing fonts to ensure that the OS and your apps now know about the traditional version of your fonts.
2 — Check the settings and options in the utility you're using to create the PDF.
Burried in each of the export methods are settings to embed fonts into the PDF and don't swap them. See the blog at https://pubcom.com/blog/tutorials/ms-office/export-pdf/index.shtml for detailed instructions. Covers whether you're using Adobe's PDF Maker plug-in or Microsoft's built-in "save as PDF" utility.
3 — You might not have the license rights to embed the font into a PDF.
This is controlled by the manufacturer of the font, not Microsoft or Adobe.
But I don't think this is the issue with Archivo because it's a Google Font and by defaul, allows the font to be embedded into any media or file without additional licensing fees. It's covered by a SIL Open Font License which you can view at https://fonts.google.com/specimen/Archivo/license
Hope this helps.
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Community Expert
in Acrobat Discussions
‎Dec 01, 2024
08:01 AM
1 Upvote
‎Dec 01, 2024
08:01 AM
1 Upvote
Because the Acrobat PDF Maker (AKA, the Acrobat Ribbon) still has this bug (where it drops the graphic's Alt Text when the graphic has a border on it), you can use Microsoft's built-in PDF export utility (File / Safe / PDF) instead.
Complete instructions and settings are in this blog -- See Method C: https://pubcom.com/blog/tutorials/ms-office/export-pdf/index.shtml
Adobe appears to have dropped the ball on many missing features and errors in the PDF Maker export utility for MS Office apps. At this time (December 2024), Microsoft's built-in PDF export utility generally makes a better tagged PDF from Word than Adobe's PDF Maker.
Very sad to see such a decline in quality and accuracy from Adobe!
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‎Nov 11, 2024
09:01 AM
@You make bad software, I'm not Adobe. Just a users like you.
Did you try reverting to the classic interface in your version of Acrobat Pro?
For both Mac and Windows, the instructions are at https://community.adobe.com/t5/acrobat-discussions/acrobat-2023-how-to-revert-to-classic-gui-user-interface/m-p/14052807
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Community Expert
in InDesign Discussions
‎Nov 03, 2024
07:48 PM
1 Upvote
‎Nov 03, 2024
07:48 PM
1 Upvote
Hi Adam @Adam34664626x5pp,
Apologies for the delayed reply. Just found your email from before.
This is a fairly large InDesign file that is part of a book. ~300 pages total.
When exporting a file individually, it follows the correct tab order.
When exporting as part of the book, it follows the layer order.Clairy8ing:fdfd
Clarlifying: TAB order is not the same as the Tag Tree reading order, nor are either the same as the Architectural/Construction reading order. Details are at this blog, https://www.pubcom.com/blog/2020_08-18_ReadingOrder/reading-orders.shtml
Threaded frames in stories is the main factor for the Tag Tree reading order (RO).
The sequence of items in the Articles Panel can also affect the Tag Tree RO.
InDesign's Layers Panel controls the Architectural/Construction RO.
And Form Fields RO is something different entirely.
If you're using InDesign's FIle / Export / Interactive PDF utililty, and if you're selecting the correct settings for accessible tagged PDF, there shouldn't be a difference whether you export the entire book or just a part of it.
The Cause of The Problem?
The reason why we cannot move layers around easily is because they're anchored within the text frame. And due to split column, some of the anchored form fields are being read in the wrong order when it comes to tab order.
This doesn't make sense. Layers are not anchored in text frames. They're not anchored to anything, and they can't be moved, either.
However, OBJECTS on the layers panel can be anchored within the text that's inside a text frame, and objects can be moved. Objects are text frames, sidebar frames, graphic frames, graphic rules, etc.
The wrong tab order is following the layer order, and the file does not allow for dragging the layers to reorder. (We think it's because it uses paragraph menu -> hamburger menu -> span columns, but not 100% sure if that's why.)
The Architectural/Construction RO is the order of the objects on the InDesign layer. The sequence is bottom - up: that is, the bottommost object is read first and the top-most object is read last. This the the InDesig Stacking Order. Have never found that Span Columns in a paragraph style affects this reading order.
We CAN reorder the layers with the Edit -> "Edit in Story Mode" with cut and paste, but the layout gets all messed up when we do that and it's not easy to get the layout back to how it started.
You reorder the OBJECTS on the Layers Panel by dragging them up/down the layers panel. Don't use Story Editor for this task.
Hope this helps your future projects.
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Community Expert
in Adobe Acrobat Online Discussions
‎Oct 23, 2024
03:55 PM
‎Oct 23, 2024
03:55 PM
Make a fillable PDF form.
You can do this in Acrobat Pro.
See https://www.adobe.com/acrobat/how-to/create-fillable-pdf-forms-creator.html for some guidance.
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‎Oct 22, 2024
11:44 AM
@Debbie5C13 and @Deleted User,
It IS possible to create a fully accessible PDF from InDesign, Word, and other source authoring programs.
However, the problems described in your posts are due to:
Elements not sufficiently created or designated for tags in the source document. (user error)
Settings not correctly set in the Export to PDF dialogues. (user error)
There is a lot to learn about how to make a source file so that it exports to an accessible PDF, including an accessible form, but the details are too numerous to detail here. And, so much about accessibilty depends upon the document itself and what's the best technique to make it accessible — there is no one-size-fits-all method to make a PDF accessible, and neither Adobe nor Microsoft nor any other company is responsible for how you create the source file and then export the PDF.
I encourage you to take a class (live or canned online video) to learn the details (like forms, accessible hyperlinks, titles, TOCs, etc.). There are many options out there, just search for it and learn.
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‎Oct 16, 2024
08:32 AM
Agree with Frans.
I've turned it off as all options are accessible already in so many ways (right click, menu bar, panels, Control panel, short cuts etc.).
By @Frans v.d. Geest
Plus, I can't customize what's in the Contextural Bar. It's populated with outdated methods of formatting content...the methods we used 35 years ago when we started this desktop publishing revolution.
Today's designers must be able to format text almost exclusively with Styles, not the manual overrides in the Contextural Bar which work fine only for the nearly-dead printing industry.
They must be able to quickly design for all kinds of media. Styles are required for:
Publishing to digital formats like EPUBs.
Making accessible PDFs, which are being required worldwide by new revised laws.
Providing HTML content from the INDD layout.
Exporting XML and other database-driven forms of automated publishing.
Is there a chance to customize the features in the Contextural Bar so that it's useful to each designer?
I've turned all of them off because I don't see any benefit in what's in them, whether it's for frames, text, or graphics.
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‎Oct 15, 2024
11:59 AM
Open and combine the PDFs using a traditional desktop version of Acrobat and see if this resolves the problem.
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‎Oct 10, 2024
08:36 PM
Hi Meenakshi, is there any update regarding this bug?
By @Hilary26082093ceuh
The bug is with the assistive technology, NVDA in this case. Contact them for more information.
Adobe can only give us the tool to add Alt Text to hyperlinks.
Adobe can't control the ATs and what they will recognize and process.
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Community Expert
in Adobe Acrobat Online Discussions
‎Oct 10, 2024
08:28 PM
‎Oct 10, 2024
08:28 PM
Short Answer. Radio Button created in In-Design don't work properly with interactve PDF's and mac preview.
By @Process77Design
Usually the problems with PDF and Apple Preview are because Preview is not fully compliant with the PDF standard. It shows/renders only what it wants to and not the fully accessible PDF, especially forms.
Complain to Apple about this, not Adobe.
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Community Expert
in Adobe Acrobat Online Discussions
‎Oct 10, 2024
08:26 PM
‎Oct 10, 2024
08:26 PM
Surely there's a solution within InDesign?
By @daisyl32031828
Yes, there is.
InDesign can create not only the basic visible text (labels, instructions, etc.) on the page, but also the form fields themselves, and weave the entire layout together into a nearly fully accessible PDF. You'll need a class in this.
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‎Oct 05, 2024
07:17 AM
To fix the screen reader issue, tag the text "ADA" as an acronym in Acrobat.
By @tayyaba_5891
A better, standards-compliant method is to use the Expansion attribute on the acronym.
1. Select the acronym's text.
2. From the Tag Panel's options menu, select Create Tag from Selection and choose the Span tag.
3. In the Tags Panel, locate the new Span tag, right-click, and select Properties.
4. In the Properties dialogue, switch to the Content TAB and spell out the acronym in the Expansion field.
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‎Sep 09, 2024
10:19 AM
@Amy336479281tvp, there are items in your Articles panel that shouldn't be there. Generally, lines, rectangles, circles, and other drawn objects are not "live" content that should be voiced to screen readers and other assistive technologies (AT), so they are:
Artifacted with the Object / Object Export Options tool, and
Not included in the Articles panel.
Items in red should NOT be included in the Articles panel.
Only text and graphics should be included.
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‎Sep 09, 2024
10:08 AM
@Amy336479281tvp, I don't see in your screen capture where InDesign says "From Master."
Where do you see this?
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‎Sep 07, 2024
12:04 AM
On my document it has a check box 'From Master' ticked eith a list of items under.
By @Amy336479281tvp
Where are you seeing this "From Master"?
Can you provide a screen grab of what you're seeing?
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‎Sep 05, 2024
07:58 PM
Remember, when you use the Articles Panel, everything that must be tagged in the exported PDF must first be in the Articles Panel.
It's an all-or-nothing tool. Either put everything in the panel, or don't use it at all.
See previous post https://community.adobe.com/t5/indesign-discussions/accessibility-tags-not-exporting-to-pdf/m-p/14262388#M552323
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‎Aug 02, 2024
10:20 AM
I think publishing a native Excel sheet will be my go-to recommendation for future clients. These table alterations in PDF are a huge time sink.
By @Sami2505
Agree! HUGE tink sink.
Just ensure that the Excel spreadsheet abidds by accessibility guidelines, too. See Microsoft's tutorials for this.
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‎Jul 31, 2024
02:43 PM
@Sami2505, unfortunately it's really not practical to export a large Excel spreadsheet such as yours to an accessible PDF. Neither Adobe nor Microsoft have given us the tools to do this.
We use these tactics instead:
Export to PDF, but delete the tags in Acrobat and retag it, either by hand or use your favorite PDF remediation tool.
Import the spreadsheet into Adobe InDesign which has the best tools for designing and exporting long tables.
Import the spreadsheet into MS Word and export to tagged PDF from there.
Publish the native Excel spreadsheet and don't bother making a PDF at all.
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‎Jul 24, 2024
03:26 PM
Hi @julietw99713499
I thought that ordering all the elements in the Articles panel would keep this from happening, but it did not.
No, the Articles panel doesn't fully control all of the reading orders in a PDF. (See blog about PDF reading orders at https://www.pubcom.com/blog/2020_08-18_ReadingOrder/reading-orders.shtml). If you have just text and graphics, the Articles Panel does little to control anything.
You'll also need to control the stacking order in InDesign's Layers Panel to get full control of them, as well as threading your story frames, and anchoring your graphics into the story threads. Sequencing the story threads in the Articles Panel is optional and may not be needed at all for simple layouts like the one you described.
And once in Acrobat, the Order Panel is mis-named — it is not THE order penl but is better named the architectural order of the PDF, one of the 4 reading orders in a PDF file.
When you change something in the architectural order panel, it can change the tags and the tag order in the Tags Tree panel, sometimes slipping text behind its frame/box and hiding it.
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‎Jul 14, 2024
07:37 PM
The PDF file format became an open source format in 2008, and since then, other companies have created PDF editors and readers.
You might have other options to use. Just Google for PDF software.
However, Adobe's Acrobat programs are still the gold standard for many industries, including accessibility, prepress, professional printing and graphic arts, and legal documents.
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‎Jul 14, 2024
07:20 PM
Three things to help you out:
1. Revert to the traditional interface:
That should bring back the familiar interface as well as restore the tools and utilities that were left out of the new interface.
In Windows Acrobat:
Locate the "hamburger menu" in the upper left corner (3 horizontal bars where the old "File" menu used to be).
Select Disable New Acrobat.
The hamburger menu in new Acrobat-Windows.
In Mac Acrobat:
From the View menu at the top, select Disable New Acroba
2. Vote your opinion at User Voice.
Be specific: phrases like I can't do "xyz" with the new interface are better.
And click the VOTE button at the top, as well post your comment.
https://acrobat.uservoice.com/forums/590923-acrobat-for-windows-and-mac/suggestions/47082691-ditch-t...
3. Give Adobe some suggestions of what you want.
Do that here: Wish List for a better interface at https://acrobat.uservoice.com/forums/590923-acrobat-for-windows-and-mac/suggestions/48153893-new-acrobat-wish-list-for-a-better-interface
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Community Expert
in Adobe Acrobat Online Discussions
‎Jul 12, 2024
11:56 PM
‎Jul 12, 2024
11:56 PM
Step #2 above creates either a .docx file or .rtf, standard word processing files that can be opened in any word processor, such as MS Word.
Are you exporting to .DOCX or .RTF?
And are you doing File / Open and selecting the file from your word processor?
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‎Jul 12, 2024
08:53 AM
Update to my previous post on June 3, 2023...using language codes.
If your language isn't available in the InDesign or Acrobat drop-down lists, then type a 639-2 language code into the field box, not 639-1 codes.
A list is available from the US Library of Congress, https://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/php/code_list.php
Note the different codes when text is "B" Bibliographic or "T" Technical. (See the intro paragraph at the top of the chart.)
—Bevi
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Community Expert
in Adobe Acrobat Online Discussions
‎Jul 11, 2024
11:17 PM
‎Jul 11, 2024
11:17 PM
Note: I don't know anything about MadCap Flare, other than what's posted on their website https://www.linkedin.com/company/techwritersblog/people/ and https://techwritersblog.com/madcap-flare-category/madcap-flare-tutorial-for-beginners-how-to-use-madcap-flare-in-3-simple-steps/
It appears to be software that creates an XML-driven CMS (content management system) for those who create tutorial, training, and other instructional content that can be cross-published in both print and digital formats. PDF is one of those formats.
... In MadCap Flare, I had the "Generate tagged document for PDF/UA" option checked in my target (under PDF Options). Unchecking the option results in PDFs that I can upload to Creative Cloud.
By @Matt30922025wbr7
I suspect that MadCap Flare's PDF converter might not follow the PDF and PDF/UA standards well enough and created a file that was not fully compatible with the PDF/UA standard. See PDF standard ISO 32000 and PDF/UA standard ISO 14289.
Looks like an interesting program for publishers, but it also looks like the software might need to be revised for creating PDF/UA compliant PDFs.
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Community Expert
in Adobe Acrobat Online Discussions
‎Jul 11, 2024
09:22 PM
‎Jul 11, 2024
09:22 PM
There have been some changes to the procedure since the original post in 2015 (it's now 2024). Here's an updated method:
Open the PDF in Adobe Acrobat.
Select File / Export / and choose Microsoft Word Document (not Word 97-2003 which is an ancient file format) or RTF (generic text format). Save the exported version to your computer.
Open the exported .DOCX or .RTF in MS Word or any other word processor you have. It should give you fully editable live text that you can now edit and format as you wish.
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‎Jul 02, 2024
12:10 PM
Be sure to voice your complaints and click the VOTE buttom! Tell the Acrobat engineers and marketing department to ditch this new "Modern" Acrobat interface. It doesn't work.
VOTE HERE: https://acrobat.uservoice.com/forums/590923-acrobat-for-windows-and-mac/suggestions/47082691-ditch-t...
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‎Jul 02, 2024
10:25 AM
Hi Jules @Juliana229272525g0z
Unfortunately, InDesign's book utility/panel has plusses and minuses. As you'll read here in the forums, many of us Community Experts avoid using it when possible, but there are times when it's essential and your project looks that way to me.
Accessibility can work so that when you export the entire PDF from the Book Panel's Options menu you'll end up with a complete PDF that should be fairly accessible (nothing is every fully accessible, not matter what you do you'll always have to tweak the PDF a bit in Acrobat).
... could I assume that the reading order will be stablished by the order that the files are organised in a book?
By @Juliana229272525g0z
First, what do you mean by "reading order": there are several different reading orders in a PDF (see blog post at https://www.pubcom.com/blog/2020_08-18_ReadingOrder/reading-orders.shtml). The 2 main ROs for accessible PDFs are:
The Tag Tree's RO, which is mainly controlled by threading your story frames, but also affected by the Articles Panel. This RO is specified in the PDF/UA standards.
The Order Tree (which shouldn't be called THE Order panel because it's not the one-and-only order in a PDF, <grin>) which we call the "Architectural Order" to help differentiate between these two orders. This RO is affected by the sequence of items in InDesign's Layers Panel. This order, although mistakenly overlooked by the PDF/UA standard, controls how the PDF will be viewed on many assistive technologies but not screen readers.
In an InDesign book, yes, the book panel's sequence of chapters controls the "big picture" RO, but each chapter's RO is controlled by each chapter.
So our workflow stresses:
Make each individual chapter as accessible as possible. Thread each chapter's main story frames from start to finish to create one story "flow," with graphics, sidebars, callouts, and other frames anchored into that story flow.
The Articles Panel is optional and often is not needed at all if your story is threaded correctly.
Control the sequence of items in the Layers Panel for each chapter. In the Layers Panel, the sequence should read bottom-up: that is the bottom-most item is read first in some technologies.
Organize the chapters in the Book Panel.
Export the entire book using the export option in the Book Panel.
This strategy works very well when we use it here at our studio for books and long documents. In my Accessible InDesign classes and book, I cover it and show several ways to accomplish this.
Best to you!
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‎Jul 01, 2024
10:53 AM
@Alessandro34199326wwsx, I'm curious which brand and model of ARM/Snapdragon computer you're using.
I'll be upgrading my systems here at my studio soon and am checking to see what works best for InDesign + Creative Suite apps.
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Community Expert
in Adobe Acrobat Online Discussions
‎Jun 14, 2024
08:50 AM
‎Jun 14, 2024
08:50 AM
Many of our browsers are now (June 2024) able to open and read PDF files, like MS Edge, Mozilla's FireFox, and Google's Chrome.
But they haven't yet provided full functionality such as filling in form fields, editing, commenting, and accessibility access. Hopefully those features will eventually be built into our common browsers.
So if all you need to do is read and print and PDF, and your browser can do that, then sure go ahead and use them.
But if you need more functions, keep your installation of Acrobat (Reader, Standard, or Pro) and use the "classic" method of downloading the PDF to your computer and then opening it in Acrobat.
You can control which software app opens a PDF by changing the settings or preferences on your computer (both Mac and Windows do this, but the technique is a bit different for each). In Windows, go to Settings / Apps / Default apps and procede from there. If you want your Edge browser to open all PDFs, the choose Edge for "PDF" files. Don't forget to reboot your computer to make it "set".
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Community Expert
in InDesign Discussions
‎May 30, 2024
11:43 AM
1 Upvote
‎May 30, 2024
11:43 AM
1 Upvote
You can also remove empty (blank) paragraphs with a common search and replace.
Edit / Find Change
Find what: ^p^p
— (note that ^p is the standard computer metacharacter for paragraph marks)
— Search for 2 in a row and replace with 1.
Change to: ^p
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